Wikivoyage talk:Archives/ProjectPage - 2018 Miniature Revitilization Project'''

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ProjectPage:2018 Miniature Revitilization Project
I am here asking about a new project that User:Andrewssi2 said was an expedititon. I believe that motivation is THE KEY to spark a good change. That is what my page is about.

In 2018, I would like to launch the project with the following goals:
 * Allow people to feel good about joining something.
 * Give small stubs and outlines an actual chance, so that a travel is not missing out on info about that place.
 * Provide an anti-persecution zone to improve pages.
 * Turn this into a successful annual project.

I plan to do this by making it a free project, and then provide templates to get going.

WikiVoyage is the worlds largest non-profit travel guide in the world, and has the best info. However, everything that exists in the world can be improved even more than their best state, and so should wikivoyage. Would you view my page, and accept? 174.45.128.124 03:11, 2 June 2017 (UTC)


 * I have to say I'm a bit confused about what this expedition is about. As far as I understand, it's a sort of pledge to edit a lot and consistently (with no break of longer than 14 days) in order to improve the overall quality of WV. So far so good, I think that's a good aim. But I am a bit confused about the following:
 * What do you mean by anti-persecution zone?
 * What is the motivation behind the non-merge clause?
 * In the countdown box on the end of the page I see a US flag. Is this supposed to be concentrated on or limited to US articles?
 * Not trying to say there's anything wrong about any of these, just a bit confused.
 * Drat70 (talk) 03:30, 2 June 2017 (UTC)


 * May I suggest that you first register a user log in rather then use an IP address. Then move the ProjectPage proposal to your user space area to propose an Expedition. --Traveler100 (talk) 05:34, 2 June 2017 (UTC)


 * I would encourage 174 to use a user login, but it seems they prefer to just use an IP according to their homepage.
 * Regardless, I have to say that my only understanding of this proposal is to encourage people to edit frequently. Although a good thing in itself, I actually don't really get why it needs formalizing in this way.
 * I would suggest that 174 takes a look at Expeditions in order to get some ideas about how to state and organize their goals. Andrewssi2 (talk) 07:26, 2 June 2017 (UTC)


 * It's a swell thing that I have feedback, so I can sort it all out. Okay, the mission is a project, potentially an experiment. As a project/experiment, members must not be fast to undo other users edits or creations. That would be persecution or condescension, which the project prohibits. This also means that in order for the 2018 MRP to have effectiveness, articles made by members, and articles assigned MRP status must not be written off for merge. The countdown box has a US flag because I didn't know how to add a WV logo there. If I were to be ranked for something, IT WOULD BE MOST FORGETFUL, so I wouldn't remember passwords, thus, I keep to an IP account. 174.45.128.124 18:22, 2 June 2017 (UTC)


 * It's inefficient that we now have two threads to discuss this proposed project. I suggest you read my response at Talk:ProjectPage:2018 Miniature Revitilization Project''', but I will just say that considering edits "persecution or condescension" shows a basic lack of understanding of what a Wiki is. If you are so attached to your edits that you analogize others editing or reverting them to torture, you are in the wrong place. Ikan Kekek (talk) 19:30, 2 June 2017 (UTC)

Expedition?
I am here asking about a new project that User:Andrewssi2 said was an expedititon. I believe that motivation is THE KEY to spark a good change. That is what my page is about.

In 2018, I would like to launch the project with the following goals:
 * Allow people to feel good about joining something.
 * Give small stubs and outlines an actual chance, so that a travel is not missing out on info about that place.
 * Provide an anti-persecution zone to improve pages.
 * Turn this into a successful annual project.

I plan to do this by making it a free project, and then provide templates to get going.

WikiVoyage is the worlds largest non-profit travel guide in the world, and has the best info. However, everything that exists in the world can be improved even more than their best state, and so should wikivoyage. Would you view my page, and accept? 174.45.128.124 03:11, 2 June 2017 (UTC)

Confused of your means

 * I have to say I'm a bit confused about what this expedition is about. As far as I understand, it's a sort of pledge to edit a lot and consistently (with no break of longer than 14 days) in order to improve the overall quality of WV. So far so good, I think that's a good aim. But I am a bit confused about the following:
 * What do you mean by anti-persecution zone?
 * What is the motivation behind the non-merge clause?
 * In the countdown box on the end of the page I see a US flag. Is this supposed to be concentrated on or limited to US articles?
 * Not trying to say there's anything wrong about any of these, just a bit confused.
 * Drat70 (talk) 03:30, 2 June 2017 (UTC)

Get your own username!

 * May I suggest that you first register a user log in rather then use an IP address. Then move the ProjectPage proposal to your user space area to propose an Expedition. --Traveler100 (talk) 05:34, 2 June 2017 (UTC)

About your proposal

 * I would encourage 174 to use a user login, but it seems they prefer to just use an IP according to their homepage.
 * Regardless, I have to say that my only understanding of this proposal is to encourage people to edit frequently. Although a good thing in itself, I actually don't really get why it needs formalizing in this way.
 * I would suggest that 174 takes a look at Expeditions in order to get some ideas about how to state and organize their goals. Andrewssi2 (talk) 07:26, 2 June 2017 (UTC)

What is my motivation, and other explanation

 * It's a swell thing that I have feedback, so I can sort it all out. Okay, the mission is a project, potentially an experiment. As a project/experiment, members must not be fast to undo other users edits or creations. That would be persecution or condescension, which the project prohibits. This also means that in order for the 2018 MRP to have effectiveness, articles made by members, and articles assigned MRP status must not be written off for merge. The countdown box has a US flag because I didn't know how to add a WV logo there. If I were to be ranked for something, IT WOULD BE MOST FORGETFUL, so I wouldn't remember passwords, thus, I keep to an IP account. 174.45.128.124 18:23, 2 June 2017 (UTC)

Persecution? NO.

 * If you want a place where others are unlikely to revert or edit your work in normal Wiki fashion if they believe they can improve upon it, you need to work in your own userspace. And if you think editing is "persecution": (A) Talk to someone who was a political detainee or a refugee who had to flee for their life; (B) With all due respect, you as yet lack a basic understanding of what Wikis are. I suggest you (re)read About. In particular, note this bullet point:


 * Wikivoyage guides are very easy to edit. Anyone can click the "edit" button and get to work. Obtaining formal peer review for edits is not necessary at all, since review is a communal function here and everyone who reads an article and corrects it is a reviewer. Essentially, Wikivoyage is self-correcting: over time, articles improve from a multitude of contributions. There is an entire infrastructure for people seeking comments, or other opinions on editorial matters. We prefer (in most cases) that people just go in and make changes they deem necessary; the community is by and large quick to respond to dubious edits (if any) and either revert or question them – and to improve wording and formatting where needed. This is very efficient; our efforts seem more constructive than those in traditional guide books. Ikan Kekek (talk) 19:23, 2 June 2017 (UTC)

Not what it sounds like, Ikan!

 * When you put it that way, I guess I sound harsh. That was nowhere close to what I am getting at. Yes, anyone can do anything on Wikivoyage, but they should not reverse edits done through the program. They can instead make improvements. And it's not all about me, it's, about all of us users together. I should note that after the project concludes 31 December 2018, none of the rules apply anymore. 174.45.128.124 21:08, 2 June 2017 (UTC)

Need I repeat myself??

 * Again: If you don't want people to edit your work, do it in your userspace. You don't get to unilaterally establish special rules of any kind for any duration in articlespace (destination articles), as Wikivoyage is a collective project. Ikan Kekek (talk) 21:21, 2 June 2017 (UTC)

Projects can't warp Wikivoyage

 * " anyone can do anything on Wikivoyage, but they should not reverse edits done through the program " - You can't get up a project where your edits are protected in this way. If the edits are in main Wikivoyage articles then bad and incorrect edits will be reversed. As Ikan mentioned, you can edit what you like in your own namespace and no-one is going to touch (assuming it is isn't spam or profane). --Andrewssi2 (talk) 21:22, 2 June 2017 (UTC)

Compromise on the project/program

 * Alright, I can see what you're saying. When I created the Gering article, I could've started on my homepage, like you're suggesting. Plus, I'll change the rule: Spam/profane will be removed if detected.


 * You know, I never meant this to be a restriction-fest, I just wanted to encourage people to create new articles, and give already existing outlines a fair chance to build. So here's what I'll do: I'll change the rule, and I'll probably not push this further. 174.45.128.124 22:27, 2 June 2017 (UTC)

Compromise Need not apply

 * I wouldn't say you need to compromise, just work within the (clearly published) policies of Wikivoyage. That said, aside from encouraging people to edit at least every 14 days it is unfortunately still not clear to me what you are trying to achieve. A recommendation may be to spend some more time editing and learning about Wikivoyage before setting up an initiative such as this. --Andrewssi2 (talk) 00:02, 3 June 2017 (UTC)

In acceptance

 * Ok, I'll check it out.
 * I think I am trying to achieve a more detailed travel guide, and allow cities and towns to be placed on the radar more easily, through the regulations I set up.

To solve the mystery of the matter

 * Although, I'm about to delete the project because of something that came to mind: You can use your user space. So why am I still pushing it? Unlike Wikipedia, Wikivoyage does not use a sandbox, so editors would create the page, and slowly improve on it. The problem is, that when the editor doesn't have much time or info on hand, but the article is worthy, the article is automatically set to merge, and it dies. I think that if articles have enough time, they can be useful guides. Hope that answers your previous question! 😀 174.45.128.124 18:34, 4 June 2017 (UTC)

Comeback to Irrational Excuses

 * (a) It's very easy to create your own sandbox by creating an article called User:[your username]/Sandbox. (b) Articles are never automatically set to merge, nor is it anything close to a guarantee that every article that isn't fleshed out will be merged. (c) Agreed that there is no project here, except whatever you yourself decide to do on your own and the extent to which you'd like others' input on whatever you're creating in your userspace. However, it's probably best not to delete this talk page, as it's not in your userspace. Ikan Kekek (talk) 19:27, 4 June 2017 (UTC)

Awesomeness!
I never knew you could do that, so I am really glad you had said that. You know, maybe it's time to use logic, and take the main page off. Just one question remains: Why didn't you say so in the first place? {|style="background: #FB4F14; border: 1px solid #abc; text-align: center; padding-left: .3em; margin-bottom: 1.5em" class="nomobile" The automatic signature is under process of re-covering. If it seems inconsistent, that's​ because this user is in transition. For now the signature will look like this: 174.45.128.124 21:52, 4 June 2017 (UTC)|}
 * Signature Notice