Talk:Colombia/Archive 2005-2012

Respect and Ethnicity
The section on Respect should be updated to give consistent advice about pointing out your country or ethnicity, regardless of your region of origin or ancestry.

Currently, this advice is inconsistent. In the current version of this article, the advice to east and southeast Asians is that pointing out one's ethnicity is difficult to do. At the same time, the advice to Europeans and white people from other world regions is that pointing out one's ethnicity is pretty easy to do.

This advice ought to be updated to tell tourists of all regions that a gentle explanation of one's country or ethnicity is fairly easy to do, and will easily be understood by most people right now in Colombia. -- 190.71.219.242 12:31, 22 January 2010 (EST)

I will add a small note saying that the 'chino' used for kids has a completely different origin, just to help Chinese tourists be more confortable.201.216.62.233 17:42, 24 September 2007 (EDT)

I made several minor corrections. This page could be moved, almost in its entirety, to a new one called "Tourism in Colombia".


 * My friend, this is not Wikipedia, this is Wikivoyage &mdash; a different site! (WT-en) Jpatokal 05:38, 7 Feb 2006 (EST)

Thanks, Jpatokal. I deleted my rant, feeling it was stupid. I did not even know Wikivoyage existed... another newbie example for the records.

Although there is still a certain amount of violence in remoter areas, the government now has a greater presence in the country and guerrilla attacks, which used to occur on a regular basis, are now far less common. It is now possible to travel by road and explore areas that would have been closed to tourists in the past. This is particularly true during the longer vacations, when the government organises convoys, escorted by troops, along popular routes.

And travelling in Colombia is definitely worthwhile. From Bogota and its temperate climate 2,600 metres above sea level, a drive of one or two hours North, South, East or West can take you to landscapes which are as diverse as they are beautiful. To the East are the oriental plains which stretch out far beyond the horizon with little modulation. To the North are the more rugged contours of the higher Andean region. To the South the weather is sub-tropical and has flora and fauna concommitant with this, and to the West one also finds hot weather with corresponding vegetation. - What is meant by "Whites and Creoles" and "Natives" in this statement: "Most Colombians are laid back regarding race issues, since white or creole persons blend naturally with natives and Afro-Colombians in everyday life"

Are Colombians solely of European/Near East (Whites) not natives? Or do you mean Native Amerindians?... because they don't usually interract much with the general Colombian society.


 * I think what he meant is that colombians are not racist at all they would not judge you for your skin color or the way you look, they will have an "aguardiente" with you regardless.

San Gil
I don't know where to put San Gil. I'll fix it later.


 * Put it under "Other Destinations"

Removed Administrative divisions
I removed the Administrative divisions. I don't think they are much of a added value for travellers -- (WT-en) Ronald 20:27, 26 Nov 2005 (EST)


 * I have no problem with this directly. But when you did that, you made a bunch of articles like Caqueta inaccessible by "drilling down" from Columbia into its subregions.  If you want to move the Admin divisions into the respective sub-regions of Columbia (the ones listed in the Regions section), that'd be just fine.  Alternatively, if you're sure you don't need the Admin divisions ever at all, then vfd them when you remove the section. Thanks! -- (WT-en) Colin 22:33, 26 Nov 2005 (EST)


 * Oops I didn't realise that. I think it's better to use the regions. Most of the Admin divs have only one or none interresting places/cities for tourists. Besides that they have the same names all over SA so it's only confusing. I'll sort it out when I'm back home in a few months. -- (WT-en) Ronald 15:19, 5 Jan 2006 (EST)

Scopolamine

 * In recent years, there have been reports of scopolamine (a date-rape drug that is absded to the victim and absorbed through the skin. Scopolamine makes the victim highly open to suggestion, allowing the attacker to use it. As it is powdered, it can be blown into the victim's face or placed on a piece of paper which is haner to confiscate your wallet, keys, or anything else they may want. Always be cautious, especially when approached by strangers.

"absded" is unintelligible, and "haner" could be "harder" or "handed", neither of which makes sense. Anyone have a clue what this means? -(WT-en) phma 23:56, 6 Jan 2006 (EST)

On second thought: "haner" may be a sentence splice, from something like "handed to the victim in order". -(WT-en) phma 23:59, 6 Jan 2006 (EST)


 * From the history: (WT-en) Ronald 15:28, 4 Feb 2006 (EST)
 * In recent years, there have been reports of scopolamine (a date-rape drug that is absorbed through the skin) being used in powdered form against unwary tourists; it can be blown into the victim's face or placed on a piece of paper which is handed to the victim and absorbed through the skin. Scopolamine makes the victim highly open to suggestion, allowing the attacker to confiscate your wallet, keys, or anything else they may want. Always be cautious, especially when approached by strangers.


 * Sorry, this just pegs my bullshit-o-meter. Scopolamine suppresses motion sickness in small doses, but causes severe hallucinations and death in large ones.  A carefully measured dose slipped into a drink, perhaps, but blown onto the face or, better yet, absorbed through paper!?  Any cites for this? (WT-en) Jpatokal 05:38, 7 Feb 2006 (EST)

A question: isn't Chile another country that is limited to both oceans? If you look well on the map, you can see some islands that are clearly in the Atlantic Ocean.


 * I have Colombian friends who know of this drug and know of people who have had unpleasant encounters with it. Censoring this warning is in very bad taste. (WT-en) Colombiantruth 12:11, 12 February 2010 (EST)
 * According to Wikipedia scopolamine CANNOT be "absorbed through the skin" in large enough quantities to effect an individual. This is just a hoax some people are trying to spread on the internet. However, scopolamine is used to rob tourists because it does render a person completely docile if ingested. I have edited the section to reflect this and also added a source. --143.44.73.5 01:06, 23 February 2010 (EST)
 * ok this is how they do it im colombian and im related to the subject because i grew up in one of the poorest neighborhoods in cali and some of the friends i used to play soccer with as a kid ended up using the scopolamine, usually they just wait by an atm at random locations of the city, waiting for the right victim thats alone (woman or senior citizens preferly) after the person is done making the transaction then they follow him or her car or from a desent distant from the atm, and then they usually put a towel or piece of cloth with the scopolamine in their face and take the person into a their car, once the person is on the effect of the drug the act friendly with the person and start asking them for the wallet and pin numbers, once done they release the person at another point of the city.

Scopolomine is a widely available deliriant that is found in european and american plants. If it was so effective as a weapon of attack, why would its use be specialised to colombia. Furthermore, putting someone under the influence of halucinogens and then creating a situation in which they are both angry and confused seems to the benefit of the drugged person. The attacker would put themselves at risk of a violent and unpredictable response. Further to that, people are capable of walking around, talking running etc while under the influence and if you simply search for the effects of datura on erowid you will see that it frequently makes people wildly (in some cases) criminally independent of the considerations or suggestions of others.````

Regions
We definitely don't need to divide Columbia up into 30-some parts, even if they are the official divisions... It's not that big of a country, dividing it up into 4-5 chunks would make it much more digestible to the traveler. If one or more of those chunks is then too large, it can be further divided... Anyone know the country well enough to take a stab at that? – (WT-en) cacahuate  talk 16:18, 1 April 2007 (EDT)

Cities
I removed a few of the cities to get the list down to 9, per WT policy - if you think others are more deserving than the ones that I left, feel free to swap them out, but please don't let the list get larger than 9...

For reference, here are the ones that I removed:
 * Armenia - the miracle city, Quindio
 * Bucaramanga - the City of the Parks
 * Cali - Heaven's branch, Valle del Cauca
 * Cúcuta - the most active border in Latin America. Sometimes called "The city without borders". Located in the Norte de Santander Department.
 * Ibagué - the musical city of Colombia, capital of Tolima
 * Pereira - The Pearl of the Otún, Risaralda
 * Popayán - the white city, Cauca
 * Tunja

Ports and harbors:


 * Bahia de Portete
 * Barranquilla
 * Buenaventura
 * Cartagena
 * Leticia
 * Puerto Bolivar
 * San Andres
 * Santa Marta
 * Tumaco
 * Turbo

– (WT-en) cacahuate  talk 16:18, 1 April 2007 (EDT)


 * You could've left Cali in at least, after all it's the third largest city in Colombia. It won't hurt if you list 10 cities instead of nine.


 * I removed mention of the road from Santa fe to Turbo being safe - it's not. Chris, PaisaTours.com

How are you going to remove cali, it is one of the most visited cities in colombia and its known as "la capital de la salsa".

Later discussion
Manizales was just added today. We cannot have more than 9 cities listed, but I think Manizales is worth having there—more so than Barranquilla, which I will remove. Other than its carnival, it's not an important touristic city, while Manizales most certainly is. --(WT-en) Peter Talk 13:28, 19 October 2011 (EDT)

you also forgot to mention
you forgot to mention that even though most people are taught English in schools most student don't even know the basics, they don't even want to learn it. i used to live in cartagena and trust mee very few people will talk in english and the ones that do,do it jokingly without even trying to sound correct or just say words that they can not even pronounce.

Warning Box
I think the warning box should be put into the "Stay Safe" section rather than right at the top. Colombia has issues but it is a great place to visit. A great big red warning sign right at the top of the article is quite imposing and deterrent. (WT-en) Aidan 16:43, 3 February 2010 (EST)


 * I see that warning sign is regularly taken down or put back up, it needs to be discussed. It was first put up by a anonymous IP. I think it has to go, that war zone safety advice is just ridiculous regarding Colombia. What do you think ? (WT-en) Rafcha 22:06, 25 February 2010 (EST)


 * The US State Department still has a travel advisory for Colombia. Is there any contrary evidence to support removal of the warning box? -- (WT-en) Ryan &bull; (talk) &bull; 22:08, 25 February 2010 (EST)


 * I think the box should be move to another section, even though some rural areas of the country still have security issues, and that crime rate has increased in cities like Cali and Medellin (According to the US department of state warning, which by the way there is an article in a Colombian newspaper "El Tiempo", that said that the government of Colombia saw this warning as unfair in some parts), Colombia is not considered anymore as a red (dangerous) zone by most countries if not all, and countries with major violence issues like Venezuela, or countries that are going through strong drug-trade-related violence issues like Mexico don't have these warning boxes.


 * Having spent a month traveling around the country, talking to locals and travelers the whole time, a warning box telling travelers to read war zone safety before coming just seems ludicruous. That box might be appropriate for certain region articles in Colombia, but at the country level it is anachronistic and not good advice. --(WT-en) Peter Talk 06:02, 17 February 2011 (EST)

Visa requirements?
Can you expand the sections - not only American or Irish travel/wish to travel to Colombia

Thanks in advance114.158.128.148 03:47, 9 February 2010 (EST)

Also for visa requirements: Why the heck is there a Sri Lanka website in the visa requirements section of the Colombia page? I think someone made a mistake.

Sources. US DOS is not a valid source.
After talking to Colombians about how their country is dealing with the drug problems I noticed a gigantic difference in what people actually experience and what the US Department of State reports. This can also be seen in the Department of State's Cuban Travel section which dramatically differs from all other accounts, whether it be the Canadian government, British government, Lonely Planet, or any other source. Their Colombian section is out of date and is not being updated to reflect the improvements. I highly recommend not using their travel section. It is propaganda and not a valid source for the reality we are trying to convey. This will be posted on Traveller's Pub.(WT-en) Stidmatt 13:14, 16 September 2011 (EDT)
 * I concur. -- A l i c e ✉ 07:48, 1 December 2012 (UTC)

Colombian pesos
There are many countries around the world that use the name "dollar" and the symbol "$" for their currency. Our usual policy is that

''Prices should be listed with the currency symbol that travellers will encounter, specifically the local formatting. The currency symbol should always be prefixed. Travellers should be able to assume that symbols used for multiple currencies (like $ or £) apply to the local currency. Do not use currency codes like "USD", "EUR", or "GBP" if the symbol is established.''


 * $100 in Detroit, not US$100, 100 USD or 100 dollars
 * $100 in Vancouver, not CAD$100, 100 CAD or 100 dollars
 * $100 in Wellington, not NZD$100, 100 NZD or 100 dollars
 * $100 in Canberra, not AUD$100, 100 AUD or 100 dollars

and I propose no change in respect of this.

However, the currency of Colombia poses special dangers of inconsistency and confusion as exemplified in our Cartagena (Colombia) article:  where in just that one section of one city article these different forms: $ (when Colombian pesos is meant, just as our policy would currently intend), $ (when US$ are actually meant), COP (both as a prefix and a suffix), Peso, peso, Pesos, pesos, CoP, C$ (but pesos are meant - not Canadian dollars), no currency specified at all, just "60,000", COP$, etc.

Colombia is unusual in having an officially recognised currency symbol of "$" that (unlike Singapore, etc) is not actually used on their banknotes - where, instead, "pesos" is printed. Since prices in the tourist industry in Colombia are also often quoted in US$, I propose that we use "pesos" instead of either the $ symbol or COP for Colombia currency.

This is somewhat analogous to the "Baht or ฿" situation discussed at Wikivoyage_talk:Currency but differs in that I propose using the plural "pesos" rather than "peso" since
 * 1) the peso is so minute as to be almost never encountered in the singular
 * 2) that is the word (in Spanish) that appears on Colombian Banknotes see Wikipedia

Does anyone disagree with my proposal?

Please voice your opinions at: Wikivoyage_talk:Currency -- A l i c e ✉ 07:48, 1 December 2012 (UTC)

Mobile to Mobile calling
I am not at all sure that this edit is correct

I think that all 10 digits must be dialled when calling from one mobile network to another within Colombia. -- A l i c <font color="#00EEFF">e <font color="#FF3333">✉ 10:25, 22 December 2012 (UTC)


 * Yup, I messed that part up. Writing the phone section has been a useful exercise, since despite multiple month long trips to Colombia, I never quite wrapped my head around all the different dialing formats. --Peter Talk 17:43, 22 December 2012 (UTC)